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i have decided to wait also... everyone was gung-ho about the ati unit until engines began blowing left and right..

i was gung-ho about turbos, until i saw how many JDM tuners are using superchargers now.. :blink:

that is rather unusual. perhaps they know something we dont.. BUT hands down i would go for one of these:


 

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I am Going to wait as well. but i am running out of things to Do to my Z. Oh well I guess I will just have to get another one and start all over.
 

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Chazzg -

How about Nismo R-tune cams, a Crawford plenum, and maybe lightweight flywheel?

My next mods are Tein coil overs with EDFC, and a 3.9 final drive ration (ring & pinion).
 

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Originally posted by Richard 350z@Jan 18 2004, 02:14 PM
Chazzg -

How about Nismo R-tune cams, a Crawford plenum, and maybe lightweight flywheel?

My next mods are Tein coil overs with EDFC, and a 3.9 final drive ration (ring & pinion).

I am going to wait on cams until 350zspeedracer gets hers in and test them out. A Crawford plenum would cause me to loose my JIC front strut Brace and my Painted Engine Cover that has been Singed by Mr. K. I am also waiting to see what LSD comes out with. I will do a Light weight Flywheel and Clutch Plate when I need a new clutch
 

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Hey All:

I'm still new at this and kinda confused over some issues.


I have been looking at GReedy twin turbos for the 350z and reading the posts here and it seems that some people have blown their engines because of adding F/I.

If I had twin turbos installed on my z would I run the risk of blowing my engine? How does it (F/I) blow the engine anyway? From reading the posts, it seems that a lot of people are waiting until the turbos are more mature and proven. If more experienced and knowledgeable people are doing that, I definitely should.


I know these are probably stimple stupid questions, but if you can help me understand, I would really appreciate it.

Thanks!

Bobby
 

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If I had twin turbos installed on my z would I run the risk of blowing my engine? Yes...Any go fast mod increases the chance of engine damage..
How does it (F/I) blow the engine anyway?
F/I doesnt blow the engine..Heat and compression generated by F/I blows the engine..There are basically 2 types of failures in general...
1) failure as a result of improper tuning,A/F too lean/Rich..Timing to far advanced causing DETONATION..There are various types and causes of DETONATION,but the basic result is increased CYLINDER TEMPURATURES and PRESSURE..Which basically leads to uncontrolled and irratic burning of the fuel in the cylinder...IE The "D" word!!!Not good for an engine and it can melt even the strongest forged pistons in seconds!!!
2)second most common type of failure (other than defects in materiald ect..) is when you basically have reached the LIMIT of the engine's design...Like pumping 400hp on Nitrous into a little 4 cylinder motor..Even with proper tuning you will in all likely send connecting rods and pistons hurling through your hood!!

Everyhting has its limits..Design,material,composition of metals ect....The 350Z engine is whats called an open deck aluminum block[/COLOR=red]
Not the strongest engine in the world and prone to basically "EXPLODING" when its aluminum design has reached its limits!!!I would estimate the stock bottom end as being somewhere in the 500-550 hp range on a flawlessly tuned engine...You want to turn up the boost and reach Supra territory you need to reinforce the block by whats called "SLEEVING" it..A process in where the cylinder walls are bsically machined out and relaced with steel ones and the block is solidified!!!Now your ready for the forged internals and 600+ HP!!!Good times
Whoo hooo!!!


From reading the posts, it seems that a lot of people are waiting until the turbos are more mature and proven. If more experienced and knowledgeable people are doing that, I definitely should. The problem is...Somebody has to take the chances so the rest of us can learn..Are you one of the few with a set of BAWLZZ to do it??I know I am!!


I know these are probably stimple stupid questions, but if you can help me understand, I would really appreciate it.
The only STUPID question is one not asked!!!Do alot of research and try to really get a grasp on EXACTLY what FI consists of both install and maint...It may or may not be for everyone,but an educated consumer is a GOOD consumer.Know what you are getting into first..
 

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My comments on the blown FI engines, particularly those with the ATI ProCharger...

It ain't the ProCharger or other major FI manufacturer mod that blows engines! It's either a bad install or bad tuning that blows up engines. Installed and tuned correctly, the ProCharger running a 7psi pulley is perfectly safe for stock internals. I think the great "blown engine" fear is a bit overplayed, largely due to the huge publicity generated by two well-known instances, both of which were bad installs/tuning.

My ProCharger has been running strong since September 2003 -- over 3,500 miles on it. Of course, I do monitor the air/fuel ratio all the time, which I consider crucial to keeping my engine healthy. I also run a little richer A/F in open loop -- 11.6-12.0 from 3,000 rpm to redline (Nissan's stock 350Z target is 12.5). The whole thing is specifically tuned for my exhaust mods as well. My ProCharger is DIY and there is a lengthy how to install and tune article on Z Chickz.
 

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Oh, I forgot to add a little blurb on compression. The VQ35DE runs a 10.3:1 compression ratio. If you want to boost higher than about 10 psi, you had better drop your compression to 8.5:1; in other words redo your internals with new rods, pistons, and valves.

The compression for the stock VG30DETT is 8.5:1. That one runs easily on 14.5 to 15 psi of boost, and you can probably safely run it a bit higher (around 18) on pump gas. The GReddy PRofec-B boost controller on my 300ZX TT allows me to run around town on low boost, and if I want to light the afterburners, I just punch up high boost. It's a really good solution to reducing wear and tear on your engine, while still having heavy duty horsepower instantly available.

And why are the Japanese switching over to superchargers on the VQ35? One look at a comparative torque curve might give you the answer. My torque shoots right up at 3,000 rpm and stays solid all the way to 6,000 rpm. The typical turbo torque curve is slow to rise and drops off rapidly. That's why I can spin my 350's wheels at 90 mph. Although my 300ZX is pretty comparable in horsepower (about 15 less) to the 350Z, there's no way it has enough torque to do that.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
yea you could drop the compression but also with higher compression you can build more power with lower boost. i know will say you will blow your engine, but IMO it all comes down to TUNING. Just like Tere and daking350z said!! Of course it would be smart to build the internals. i say this b/c i had a Integra type R which has 10.6:1 compression, and was so close to buying a turbo kit, until the next morning i come out and my baby was STOLEN!!
I guess this subject is a never ending topic
 

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One little comment on the Overboost photos above. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the top photo ain't a supercharger. It's a very uniquely mounted single turbo. They've got the exhaust channeled up and back down on the left side as you face the engine. The turbine is clearly to the left as you face the engine, and the compressor is to the right. Of course, with that top mount single turbo, you're going to have a huge hump in the hood -- it looks like it sticks way up there. It's got to have some really complex exhaust plumbing. Interesting prototype, but I'm not too sure it will have a big following unless they've got some kind of incredible horsepower output. ;)
 

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Originally posted by toykilla@Jan 16 2004, 06:58 PM
i have decided to wait also... everyone was gung-ho about the ati unit until engines began blowing left and right..

i was gung-ho about turbos, until i saw how many JDM tuners are using superchargers now..  :blink:

that is rather unusual. perhaps they know something we dont.. BUT hands down i would go for one of these:



Which turbo kit is in the 1st pic?
 

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Here's a closer photo and it sure is a single turbo! Check out the intercooler mounting! Now, where did they put the radiator? The whole engine bay is completely re-engineered. My guess it's AP Engineering (logo on the front of the Z).

 

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Knowing how everything is routed presently in the 350 -- I've taken just about everything in the engine bay apart -- the exhaust routing alone for that setup is a killer (not to mention the cooling system). You won't believe how much stuff you would have to reroute to get it in there. Basically, for an install such as this, you would redo the entire engine bay -- months worth of work. And to what end? I can't imagine that single turbo giving you anything special. The current traditional mount twin turbos and superchargers can run your boost up to the max the VQ35DE can take on stock internals (and higher too).

Thanks but no thanks -- it's just ain't worth the effort. IMHO, it's all bling-bling and no big go. Nice, gee whiz stuff for the Auto Salon, but I don't see much that's very practical with that set up.

What you really might hold out for is the new direct drive clutch-type superchargers coming out of Japan. Very cool -- very innovative -- and powerful little buggers (I think they're rigging 'em with dual superchargers).
 

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Originally posted by toykilla@Jan 16 2004, 06:58 PM
i have decided to wait also... everyone was gung-ho about the ati unit until engines began blowing left and right..

i was gung-ho about turbos, until i saw how many JDM tuners are using superchargers now..  :blink:

that is rather unusual. perhaps they know something we dont.. BUT hands down i would go for one of these:

Not entirely true. One of my business contacts for TI works over at Top Secret Japan. They are NOT happy w/ the supercharger at all. I originally went to him when Christi wanted certain specs on some Tomei cams, and when it was mentioned that she was going to go s/c a long lecture was provided. I already know why a turbocharger is "better" than a supercharger, but I asked anyway. His response? Go read any turbo vs. s/c comparison article. He said they've already built several of each car, and the turbo one out performs in every way possible.

Now I don't have a 350z and claim to know the VQ, but I do know that the new technology turbos that are out on the market are simply amazing. Making big power and having major lag isn't an issue anymore.

Anyway I'm just speaking generally.
 
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