[davidm]

In the latest issue of Motor they have an article (kind of mini PCOTY) where they took a large assortment of local Holden and Ford variants at Eastern Creek. They measured the lap-times, top-speed acceleration and even put them all on a dyno. All at the same place, same day and same driver. This is what they came back with:

Eastern Creek lap-times:
- Falcon XT = 2:05.97
- Commodore Acclaim = 2:03.90
- Falcon XR6 = 2:01.46
- Commodore SV6 = 2:00.61
- Falcon XR6 Turbo = 1:58.05
- Falcon XR8 = 1:57.86
- FPV Persuit Ute = 1:57.59
- HSV GTO Coupe (297kW) = 1:57.38
- Monaro CV8 = 1:57.21
- Commodore SV8 = 1:57.07
- FPV Falcon GT = 1:56.99
- HSV Coupe 4 = 1:56.74
- HSV Clubsport (297kW) = 1:55.96
- Commodore SS = 1:55.26

Eastern Creek top-speed:
- Falcon XR6 = 183kph
- Commodore SV6 = 183kph
- Falcon XR6 Turbo = 195kph
- HSV Coupe 4 = 199kph
- Commodore SV8 = 200kph
- Commodore SS = 201kph
- Falcon XR8 = 202kph
- FPV Persuit Ute = 202kph
- Monaro CV8 = 203kph
- FPV Falcon GT = 206kph
- HSV GTO Coupe (297kW) = 208kph
- HSV Clubsport (297kW) = 211kph

 

[ky350]

WOW - a bog standard SS beat the Clubie around the track - why pay 100 big ones when you get the same or better performance from the donor car that's worth only 1/2 the price of the HSV?

 

[davidm]

WOW - a bog standard SS beat the Clubie around the track - why pay 100 big ones when you get the same or better performance from the donor car that's worth only 1/2 the price of the HSV?

They do make a mention of it, but from what they say it comes down to the tyres. The tyres that the HSVs come with are alegedly 'comfort' tyres, but do not offer much grip.

btw, HSVs have been getting slower over the last 4 years or so, and that is despite the annual power hikes. Reason is that they keep on putting on them tyres that are less and less perfromance oriented. 4 years ago HSVs wore arguably the pest performance tyres around - S02s.

Though, I'm baffled why ther SV8 and CV8 are so far of the SS time ... I'll have to see wha tyres they are wearing but I'm pretty sure that the CV8 is on RE040s like the 350Zs.

 

[zuffy]

The standard SS is lighter than all of them... i'd say that and the tyres made the difference.

 

[davidm]

The standard SS is lighter than all of them

SV8 is even lighter ... I think about 40kg lighter than the SS. I would have thought that SS and SV8 are on the same tyres, but maybe they are not ... will have a look when I get the chance.

Though SS is now about 40kg lighter than the CV8 and more like 60kg lighter than the Clubsport.

i'd say that and the tyres made the difference.

That's what it looks like .... I just read that HSV is about to launch some 'club spec' package for their range that will 18" wheels (instead of 19") and perfromance oriented tyres to combat this trend. Though, not R-spec tyres from what I'm reading.

 

[scathing]

The SS has sports suspension, whereas the CV8 still has comfort suspension.

I don't know why HSV has been going all comfort tyre on their cars. I thought they were meant to be sports cars? Maybe they've gone all middle-aged and they're after sleds that are comfortable and quick in a straight line, rather than a proper handling package.

 

[ky350]

HSV's are now wearing "comfort" tyres like Pirellis because the SO2's would wear down to the belts on the insides of the tyres within 5-10,000km. Hence the harder wearing Pirellis as the owners were complaining about the cost of replacement tyres.

 

[scathing]

Bloody whingers.

If you're going to buy a sports car, you've got to expect that the tyres aren't going to last. They're sports tyres that wear quickly by providing you grip.

Of course, HSV could go the other way and build lighter cars that don't make the same demands of the tyres...

 

[davidm]

because the SO2's would wear down to the belts on the insides of the tyres within 5-10,000km.

From my experience that is only the case if you're not aware of how much pressure you need in them. They need 40 - 45psi (cold) on the HSVs, depending on how you drive. If you carry any passangers, cruise at speeds at 100kph+, or drive it agressively then they need 45psi ... maybe even a bit more.

My father's HSV R8 shreaded the inside of the rear S02s while being fully loaded and sitting on 160 - 230kph for prolonged periods of time. The problem was that he had 'only' 35psi (cold) in the tyres. With the next set he never dropped bellow 45psi (cold) and did not have any excessive wear issues.

 

[ky350]

David - as you state incorrect pressures probably lead to all the wear problems. I suspect that neither HSV or Bridgestone recommended inflating to 45psi and most owners would have had their tyres inflated to mid 30s. BTW, >45psi is a **** high pressure considering that most hi-po tyres are only rated to 51psi.

 

[davidm]

I suspect that neither HSV or Bridgestone recommended inflating to 45psi and most owners would have had their tyres inflated to mid 30s.

I'd say you're 100% correct. My dad had to figure out the proper operating range for the S02s himself ... I have not seen anywhere mentioned that one should run pressures so high, nor did anyone ever say that. HSV should have been publicising that every chance they got.

 

[db350z]

but i thought the S02 were really bad to handle in Wet? S03 are more Versatile on dry and wet?

i never know the Pirelli P-Zero is a Comfort Tyres I always throught the P-zero is better than S02 or the same class

 

[davidm]

but i thought the S02 were really bad to handle in Wet? S03 are more Versatile on dry and wet?

I did not find the S03s comparable to the S02s in any respect. From my experience they are just different class of tyres. S03s are a nice all around tyre, while the S02s being the perfromance frag-ship. In the wet I did not find much difference but then I probably do not push as hard as in the dry.

i never know the Pirelli P-Zero is a Comfort Tyres I always throught the P-zero is better than S02 or the same class

Likewise. Untill a couple years ago I thought the same. Though, I'm sure that they make several different versions of P-Zeros Rossos and some are bespoke made for particular cars ... on those cars (ie. Ferraries) they might be the flagship perfromance tyree that we thought that they were.

 

[mchapman]

David know anything about the Bridgestone RE-01?

Ive seen these on the NSXs and GTRs in a few Best Motoring videos and was wondeirng what these are like.

I dont think they sell them here so they would need to be imported from Japan.

 

[davidm]

David know anything about the Bridgestone RE-01?

No, only what I've read about them ... so probably no more than you. Though, I did see a local advertizing campaign for the RE-01s a little while ago (in the local car-mags) so I would have thought that they are (or were) here.

From reading about them they seem to be more performance oriented than the S03s so they are certainly worth a look.

 

[sushantjare]

From my experience that is only the case if you're not aware of how much planetary geared motor is important to calculate the performance oriented motor