[scathing]

R34 V Spec II NUR held the fastest lap time for a production car at the Nurburgring at 7:52, seven seconds quicker than the best R33. but i don't know the year. that time has probably been superceded by now.

The 7:59 R33 GT-R record is bogus. The car wasn't in production trim. It was one of the final development vehicles, and was running non-standard boost, Comp-R slicks and a full cage. Of course, that means it was basically a 400R (plus a cage).......

I'm not sure about the 7:52 time achieved by the R34, but technically that means the first "production" car to crack 8 mins was the Porsche 996 Turbo.


Still, I doubt the the 997 Turbo nor the new GT-R will be able to match the XTR4's sub 7 minute lap.

 

[bonzelite]

found this:

Nurburgring最速排行榜-Nurburgring Lap Times

6:59 --- Ferrari 312T, Niki Lauda, German GP, training (1975)
7:06 --- Ferrari 312T, Clay Regazzoni, German GP, race (1975)
*1.2km longer circuit than standard Nordschleife

6:11 --- Porsche 956, Group C, Stefan Bellof, training (1983)
6:26 --- Porsche 956, Group C, Stefan Bellof, race (1983)
6:41 --- Porsche 956, Group C, Derek Bell
7:50 --- BMW X5 Le Mans V12, Hans Stuck (2001)
*0.232 km longer than current, standard Nordschleife

7:06 --- BMW M3 GTR, 24hrs, test session, J?rg Müller (2003)
7:18.1-- Donkervoort D8 RS (12/2004)
7:19 --- Radical SR3 Turbo (2003)
7:20* -- Opel Astra DTM V8 Coupe, set-up for 24hrs race (sport auto 2003) *estimated
7:25 --- Alzen Motorsport Porsche 996, 24hrs race, Uwe Alzen
7:28 --- Porsche Carrera GT, Walther R?hrl, Autobild July 2004
7:32.4 -- Porsche Carrera GT, definitive time by Horst Von Saurma
7:32.5 - Gemballa Porsche GTR 600 EVO, Wolfgang Kaufmann (2001)
7:36 --- Porsche Carrera GT, factory test driver Walther R?hrl (2002)
7:40* -- Porsche Carrera GT, *estimated time on cold and partially wet track (2003)
7:40 --- Mercedes Benz McLaren SLR, Klaus Ludwig, Autobild July 2004
7:42 --- Radical 1500 SR3 (2002)
7:43 --- TechArt GT Street (2001)
7:43 --- Porsche 996 911 GT3 RS, factory test driver Walter Rohrl, MOTOR Magazine
7:43.5 - Lamborghini Murcielago (Autocar magazine, 2002)
7:44 --- Pagani Zonda C12S (07/2003)
7:45 --- Gemballa Porsche GTR 600 (12/2000)
7:46 --- Porsche 996 GT2
7:46 --- SHK Porsche 993 GT2, 652 PS (1999)
7:47 --- Porsche 996 GT3 RS, 381PS (996) (2004)
7:49 --- Porsche 996 GT3 Cup
7:50 --- BMW E46 M3 CSL (08/2003)
7:50 --- Blitz Supra, 750 PS, Herbert Schürg (1997)
7:50 --- Honda RC30, Helmut Daehne (1993)
7:50 --- Lamborghini Murcielago (06/2002)
7:52 --- Gemballa Porsche 911 Le Mans (1995)
7:52 --- Lamborghini Gallardo E-Gear (12/2003)
7:52 --- Mercedes Benz SLR McLaren (06/2004)
7:54 --- Porsche GT3 (996) (2003)
7:55 --- Caterham R500 Superlight (2002)
7:56 --- Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale (02/2004)
7:56 --- Porsche 996 Turbo
7:56 --- Chevrolet Corvette C6 (tested by Dave Hill)
7:56.73- Honda NSX-R 黑泽元治(2002)
7:57 --- Lotec Porsche 993 Turbo, 600 PS, racing suspension
7:59 --- Porsche 911 Carrera S (997) (Performance Chassis) (Walter Rohrl - WHEELS June 2004)
8:01.72- Nissan R33GT-R 黑泽元治(1995)
8:02 --- Porsche 911 Carrera S (997) (Sport PASM setting) (Walter Rohrl - WHEELS June 2004)
8:03 --- Porsche 996 GT3 (1999)
8:03.86- Honda NSX-R 黑泽元治(1992)
8:04 --- Lamborghini Diablo GT (07/2000)
8:05 --- Ferrari 575M Maranello F1 (12/2002)
8:05 --- Porsche 911 Carrera S (997) (Normal PASM setting)(Walter Rohrl - WHEELS June 2004)
8:06 --- Mercedes Benz SL55 AMG
8:06 --- Caterham 7 Superlight R, Robert Nearn
8:06.1 - Subaru WRX STi Spec-C 黑泽元治 (2004)
8:07 --- Ferrari 550 Maranello (06/1998)
8:09 --- Honda NSX-R 3.2 (08/2002)
8:09 --- Ferrari 360 Modena (10/1999)
8:09 --- Lamborghini Diablo SV (no ABS?)
8:10 --- Chrysler Viper GTS, 411PS, UK-Spec, no ABS (10/1997)
8:10 --- Donkervoort D8 180R
8:11 --- Mitsubishi Lancer EVO IX (06/2004)
8:12 --- Mercedes Benz SL55 AMG (04/2002)
8:12 --- Porsche 993 Turbo
8:13 --- Lotus Esprit Sport 350, 354 PS (05/1999)
8:13 --- Dodge Viper SRT-10, 506 PS (10/2004)
8:13 --- BMW M5 (E60) (12/2004)
8:14.98- Mitsubishi Lancer GSR Evolution VI MR 中谷明彦(2003)
8:15 --- Ruf 911 CTR 2, 520 PS
8:15*-- Holden GTS (2000), *estimated
8:15 --- Porsche 911 Carrera 2 (997) (Walter Rohrl - WHEELS June 2004)
8:16 --- AC-Schnitzer E36 M3 CLS II, 350 PS (11/1997)
8:16 --- AC Schnitzer Z4 V8 Topster (01/2005)
8:16.15- Honda NSX 黑泽元治 (1990)
8:17 --- Aston Martin Vanquish (2003)
8:17 --- Porsche 996 C2
8:18 --- BMW Z8, 400 PS (08/2000)
8:18 --- Chevrolet Corvette Z05 Commemorative Edition, 344 PS (09/2003)
8:18 --- Ferrari F355 (06/1997)
8:20 --- Audi RS6 (2002)
8:22 --- BMW E46 M3 (12/2000)
8:22 --- BMW M Coupe, 321 PS (10/1998)
8:22 --- Mercedes-Benz C55 (07/2004)
8:22.38- Nissan R32GT-R 黑泽元治 (1989)
8:23 --- Aston Martin DB7 GT (2003)
8:23 --- Porsche 996 Carrera 4
8:24 --- Subaru Impreza WRX STi (2004)
8:25 --- Audi RS4 375 HP
8:25 --- Callaway C12
8:25 --- Mitsubishi Carisma GT Evo VI (11/1999)
8:25 --- Mitsubishi Carisma GT Evo VII (11/2002)
8:26 --- Mercedes Benz SLK 32 AMG (05/2001)
8:26 --- Nissan 350Z (2003)
8:28 --- BMW M5, 400 PS(also confirmed by Motor Commodore magazine, 2000)
8:28 --- Nissan Skyline GTR, 277 PS
8:28 --- Porsche 993 Carrera 2
8:29 --- Mercedes Benz CLK 55 AMG (05/2000)
8:29 --- Audi S4 4.2 Avant (11/2003)
8:30 --- Maserati Coupé Cambiocorsa (10/2002)
8:31 --- Ferrari F355 GTS, 380 PS
8:32 --- BMW M Roadster, 321 PS (09/1997)
8:32 --- BMW Z4 3.0 SMG (05/2003)
8:32 --- Porsche Boxster S
8:32 --- Volkswagen Golf R32
8:34 --- Acura NSX, 276 PS
8:34 --- BMW Z3 Coupé 3.0i, 231 PS (04/2001)
8:35 --- BMW M3 Coupe, 321 PS
8:35 --- Brabus-Mercedes Benz C V8 Sportcoupé (02/2002)
8:35 --- BMW 130i >>> Link
8:36 --- BMW E36 M3 EVO, 321 PS
8:36 --- Alpina-BMW B3 3.3 Coupé (07/1999)
8:37 --- Maserati 3200GT (2002)
8:37 --- Mercedes Benz C32 AMG (09/2001)
8:37 --- Nissan Skyline GTR V-Spec, 350 PS
8:37 --- Subaru Impreza GT Turbo
8:37 --- Honda NSX 3.0 (07/1991)
8:38 --- Honda NSX 3.2 (08/1997)
8:38 --- Mercedes Benz SL500 (12/2001)
8:38 --- Porsche 996 Carrera, 296 PS
8:38 --- Brabus-Mercedes Benz CLK 5.8 (12/1998)
8:39 --- Honda S2000 (01/2000)
8:39 --- Morgan Aero 8 (04/2003)
8:40 --- Holden GTS, on an in and out lap (2000)
8:40 --- Chevrolet Corvette C5 Targa Automatic (07/1997)
8:41 --- Aston Martin DB7 (1999)
8:41 --- Audi S3, 210 PS (06/1999)
8:42 --- Audi S4, 265 PS (08/1998)
8:42 --- Lotus Exige (11/2000)
8:43 --- Honda Integra Type R (12/2000)
8:44 --- Chevrolet Corvette C5
8:45 --- Chevrolet Corvette, 339 PS, automatic
8:46 --- Porsche 993 Carrera S, 285 PS
8:47 --- Honda Civic Type-R, 200 PS (11/2001)
8:49 --- Jaguar XKR Coupe (07/1998)
8:49 --- Renault Clio Sport V6
8:49 --- Audi TT 1.8T quattro Coupé, 225 PS (11/1998)
8:50* -- Mercedes Benz E55 AMG (2000)
8:51 --- Mercedes Benz C43 AMG (02/1998)
8:52 --- Mercedes Benz CLK 430
8:58 --- Lotus Esprit Turbo SE (07/1991)
9:09 --- Volkswagen Golf V6 4Motion

http://www.gtkings.com/forum/simple/index.php?t4831.html
http://www.nordschleife.no/

 

[bonzelite]

welp, i don't see a GTR anywhere on the list faster than 8:00mn. but i do see Corvette C6 at 7:56. i cited 2 sources below on the last post to corroborate this. so the info i had about the V-Spec II Nur GTR34 must be heresay or bogus, too.

what i don't understand is that being that the GTR34 V-Spec II "Nur" is deliberately spec'd and named as a tribute and homage to the Nurburgring, why are it's laptimes either not listed officially, or mysterious? rather, how many "official" lists are there, then? and where are they? you'd think that car would wear it's laptimes on it's sleeve. but it doesn't apparently. and why is there no Z-Tune Nurburgring time? they didn't run that thing around the 'Ring, too? almost certainly with the right driver, it would break the 8:00 barrier.

the dominant cars are clearly Porsche and Ferrari.

 

[scathing]

The Nur spec R34s are actually the "soft", grand touring models. Its the only models with leather, and the regular Nur has a softer suspension setup than the original GT-R. The V-Spec Nur has the V-Spec aero parts, but it still has leather and creature comforts etc....

The quickest "Nissan R34 GT-R" (i.e. non-Nismo) is the N1. Same engine as the Nur (well, they took the N1 setup which came out first) but without all the heaviness.

 

[bonzelite]

thanks, scathing, for that bit of info. i was not fully clear about the Nur, then, nor the N1 GTR. coolness. i learn something new every day.

but how about lap times for them? and the Z-Tune? you cannot tell me such times do not exist. they **** well ran the Z-Tune there. any clues?

 

[scathing]

The official time for the original R34 (i.e. at first release) was 7:52. I'm not sure if its got R33-style caveats for its time though.

No idea about lap times for any of the other variants. I have seen no numbers published anywhere.

The N1 runs steel wheeled turbos and more boost, as well as all the V-Spec II aero, plus various other homologation parts to make it eligible for the N1 production car endurance racing series. So one can only assume that its faster than that 7:52, assuming the time was set in production trim. Or equalling that 7:52, if it wasn't.

As for that particular Z-Tune, as it says in the video it was also a development car. The head engineer of Nismo has said in an interview in the UK's "EVO" magazine that the hardware is good for 620ps, but then they'd hit emissions issues which is why it was throttled back to 500ps. So who knows what power the engine was making at the time? And what suspension setup and aero package it was using?

 

[tekknikal]

regarding the z06 vs gtr argument,
the fastest recorded gtr nurburgring time is 7'59" for an R33. The R34 may be faster, but as far as anyone knows that hasnt yet been proven on the nurburgring. (ie no one can provide the date/driver/car/mods for a faster time)
the fastest z06 time is 7'42.9" this is well documented.

do those few seconds matter? that question is like asking if the quarter mile time matters. to some obviously it doesnt. after all, a vast majority of people who buy a given car cant take that car within 10% of its limits, enthusiasts included.

if you want to measure a car's ability to perform however, its a really good way to do it. and to many, this matters.
is the z06 the benchmark by which all other performance cars are measured? obviously not, but it is the best performance per dollar stock vehicle right now. anyone else making a sports car that tries to imply performance value will inevitably be compared against it.

having said that, im not a vette fan and dont think i'd ever buy one. but, i cant deny the performance/dollar. that car deserves a lot of respect. i dont see how any open minded person cant respect that car.

as for the upcoming gt-r, i only hope for a sub 8 minute time.

here's another list of 'ring times:

6:55* -- 178.699 km/h -- Radical SR8, 360 PS/650 kg, Michael Vergers (sep,28 05),
(* street-legal only in the UK)
7:12* -- 173.600 km/h -- Radical SR3 Turbo, 320 PS/500 kg (test drive 07/03) (*mfr.)
7:14.89 172.181 km/h – Donkervoort D8 270 RS, , 350 PS/600 kg, Michael Düchting (nov,6 05),
7:15.63 169.311 km/h -- Edo Porsche 996 GT2 RS, 542 PS/1284 kg, Patrick Simons (sport auto 09/05)
7:18.01 170.236 km/h -- Donkervoort D8 RS, 370 PS/670 kg, Michael Duechting, sport auto 12/2004, >>>
7:19* -- 168.929 km/h -- Radical SR3 1500 Turbo, Phil Bennet (jun,15 03) (*mfr.),
7:28 --- 166.652 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, Walther Roehrl,(Autobild 07/04)
7:32* -- 164.071 km/h – Pagani Zonda F, 650 PS/ 1230 kg, (*mfr.)
7:32.44 163.911 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, definitive time Horst von Saurma (sport auto 01/04)
7:32.52 163.882 km/h -- Gemballa Porsche GTR 600 EVO, Wolfgang Kaufmann (sport auto 01) ,
7:33 --- 163.708 km/h -- Pagani Zonda F, 602 PS/ 1371 kg, Horst von Saurma (sport auto 05/06),
7:34 --- 163.586 km/h -- Koenigsegg CCR, 806 PS/1418 kg, Horst von Saurma (sport auto), oct,17-18 05,
7:36 --- 162.631 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, factory test driver Walther Röhrl (02)
7.39* -- 161.575 km/h -- Porsche 997 GT3, 415 PS/1395 kg, *mfr. (quote sport auto 05/06)
7:39 --- 161.575 km/h -- Koenigsegg CCR, 806 PS/1180 kg,
7:39.39 161.219 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, Walther Röhrl (AutoBild 02/06)
7:40 --- 161.217 km/h – Bugatti 16/4 Veyron, 1001 PS/1980 kg (Wheels magazine Australia, 12/05)
7:40 --- 161.217 km/h -- Mercedes Benz SLR McLaren, Klaus Ludwig (AutoBild 07/04)
7:40* -- 161.217 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1495 kg, *cold and partially wet track (sport auto 12/03)
7:40 --- 161.217 km/h -- Porsche 997 Turbo, 480 PS/ ??? kg, Michelin Cup Sport tyres (Motortrend)
7:41 --- 160.868 km/h -- Manthey Porsche GT3 M410, 413hp (AutoBild 07/04) ,
7:42* -- 160.519 km/h – Ford GT, 550 PS/ 1521 kg (*as indicated by Octane magazine, 11/05)
7:42 --- 160.519 km/h -- Mosler MT900S Photon, Joao Barbosa, (04) (according to dailysportscar.net)
7:42 --- 160.519 km/h -- Radical 1500 SR3, 230 PS/510 kg (02)
7:42.9 - 160.207 km/h -- Corvette Z06, 500 PS/1319 kg, Jan Magnusen, (Sporbilen, jun,26 05),
7:43 --- 160.173 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3 RS, factory test driver Walter Roehrl (MOTOR magazine)
7:43 --- 160.173 km/h -- TechArt Porsche GT Street, 620 PS/1453 kg, (sport auto 08/02)
7:43.5 - 160,000 km/h -- Lamborghini Murcielago (Autocar magazine 02)
7:44 --- 159.828 km/h -- Pagani Zonda C12 S, 555 PS/1388 kg (sport auto 07/02)
7:45 --- 159.484 km/h -- Gemballa Porsche GTR 600, 600hp (00)
7:45* -- 159.484 km/h -- McLaren F1, *estimated lap time from a video available at www.pistonheads.tv
7:46 --- 159.142 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT2, 462 PS/1450 kg (sport auto 06/01)
7:46 --- 159.142 km/h -- Jaguar XJ220, John Walton (EVO magzine 07/00),
7:46 --- 159.142 km/h -- SHK Porsche 993 GT2, 652 PS (sport auto 99)
7:47 --- 158.801 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3 RS, 381 PS (sport auto 03/04)
7:49 --- 158.124 km/h – BMW X5 Le Mans, 700 PS/~2000 kg, Hans-Joachim Stuck
7.49 --- 158.124 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3, 392 PS (AutoBild 2004),
7:49 --- 158.124 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3 Cup, 360 PS/1207 kg (sport auto 02/99)
7:49.72 157.885 km/h -- Honda RC30, Helmut Daehne (93) (moto bike)
7:50 --- 157.787 km/h -- BMW E46 M3 CSL (sport auto 08/03)
7:50 --- 157.787 km/h -- Lamborghini Murcielago, 462 PS/1450 kg (sport auto 06/02)
7:50 --- 157.787 km/h -- Westfield Super 7 with Hayabusa engine, >>>
7:52 --- 157.119 km/h – Ford GT, 550 PS/1599 kg (sport auto 02/06),
7:52 --- 157.119 km/h -- Gemballa Porsche 911 Le Mans (sport auto 95)
7:52 --- 157.119 km/h -- Lamborghini Gallardo E-gear, 493 PS/1496 kg (sport auto 12/03)
7:52 --- 157.119 km/h -- Mercedes Benz SLR McLaren (sport auto 06/04)
7:54 --- 156.456 km/h -- Mercedes CLK DTM AMG, 582 PS/1678kg, (sport auto 03/05), >>>
7:54 --- 156.456 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3 (sport auto 06/03)
7:55 --- 156.126 km/h -- Caterham R500 Superlight, Robert Nearn (EVO magazine 07/00)
7:55 --- 156.126 km/h – Ferrari F430 F1, 490 PS/1493 kg (sport auto 01/06),
7:56 --- 155.798 km/h -- Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale, 425 PS/1387 kg (sport auto 02/04)
7:56 --- 155.798 km/h -- Porsche 996 Turbo, 420 PS/1569 kg (sport auto 06/00)
7:56* - 155.798 km/h -- Chevrolet Corvette Z06 ,company chief engineer Dave Hill (*mfr.)
7:56.50 155.594 km/h -- Mercedes CLK DTM AMG, 582 PS/1678kg, Klaus Ludwig (AutoBild 02/06)
7:56.65 155.569 km/h – Lamborghini Gallardo SE, 520 PS/1560 kg, Tom Kristensen (AutoBild 02/06)
7:56.73* 155.569 km/h -- Honda NSX-R (*Best Motoring video "Carrera Invasion", lap not complete)
7:57 --- 155.472 km/h -- Lotec Porsche 993 Turbo, 600PS/1558 kg (sport auto 05/98)
7:58 --- 156.652 km/h -- Audi RS4 4.2 V8 FSI, 420 PS/ 1650 kg, Frank Stippler, (10/05)
7:59 --- 154.822 km/h -- Porsche 997 Carrera S, PASM setting “Performance”, (Walter Roehrl WHEELS 06/ 2004)
7:59* -- 154.822 km/h -- Chevrolet C6 Z51, company test driver Dave Hill (*mfr.)
7:59 --- 154.822 km/h -- Nissan Skyline R33 GT-R, Dirk Schoymans (Autocar magazine 97)

 

[tekknikal]

regarding the z06 vs gtr argument,
the fastest recorded gtr nurburgring time is 7'59" for an R33. The R34 may be faster, but as far as anyone knows that hasnt yet been proven on the nurburgring. (ie no one can provide the date/driver/car/mods for a faster time)
the fastest z06 time is 7'42.9" this is well documented.

do those few seconds matter? that question is like asking if the quarter mile time matters. to some obviously it doesnt. after all, a vast majority of people who buy a given car cant take that car within 10% of its limits, enthusiasts included.

if you want to measure a car's ability to perform however, its a really good way to do it. and to many, this matters.
is the z06 the benchmark by which all other performance cars are measured? obviously not, but it is the best performance per dollar stock vehicle right now. anyone else making a sports car that tries to imply performance value will inevitably be compared against it.

having said that, im not a vette fan and dont think i'd ever buy one. but, i cant deny the performance/dollar. that car deserves a lot of respect. i dont see how any open minded person cant respect that car.

as for the upcoming gt-r, i only hope for a sub 8 minute time.

here's another list of 'ring times:

6:55* -- 178.699 km/h -- Radical SR8, 360 PS/650 kg, Michael Vergers (sep,28 05),
(* street-legal only in the UK)
7:12* -- 173.600 km/h -- Radical SR3 Turbo, 320 PS/500 kg (test drive 07/03) (*mfr.)
7:14.89 172.181 km/h – Donkervoort D8 270 RS, , 350 PS/600 kg, Michael Düchting (nov,6 05),
7:15.63 169.311 km/h -- Edo Porsche 996 GT2 RS, 542 PS/1284 kg, Patrick Simons (sport auto 09/05)
7:18.01 170.236 km/h -- Donkervoort D8 RS, 370 PS/670 kg, Michael Duechting, sport auto 12/2004, >>>
7:19* -- 168.929 km/h -- Radical SR3 1500 Turbo, Phil Bennet (jun,15 03) (*mfr.),
7:28 --- 166.652 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, Walther Roehrl,(Autobild 07/04)
7:32* -- 164.071 km/h – Pagani Zonda F, 650 PS/ 1230 kg, (*mfr.)
7:32.44 163.911 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, definitive time Horst von Saurma (sport auto 01/04)
7:32.52 163.882 km/h -- Gemballa Porsche GTR 600 EVO, Wolfgang Kaufmann (sport auto 01) ,
7:33 --- 163.708 km/h -- Pagani Zonda F, 602 PS/ 1371 kg, Horst von Saurma (sport auto 05/06),
7:34 --- 163.586 km/h -- Koenigsegg CCR, 806 PS/1418 kg, Horst von Saurma (sport auto), oct,17-18 05,
7:36 --- 162.631 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, factory test driver Walther Röhrl (02)
7.39* -- 161.575 km/h -- Porsche 997 GT3, 415 PS/1395 kg, *mfr. (quote sport auto 05/06)
7:39 --- 161.575 km/h -- Koenigsegg CCR, 806 PS/1180 kg,
7:39.39 161.219 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1475 kg, Walther Röhrl (AutoBild 02/06)
7:40 --- 161.217 km/h – Bugatti 16/4 Veyron, 1001 PS/1980 kg (Wheels magazine Australia, 12/05)
7:40 --- 161.217 km/h -- Mercedes Benz SLR McLaren, Klaus Ludwig (AutoBild 07/04)
7:40* -- 161.217 km/h -- Porsche Carrera GT, 612 PS/ 1495 kg, *cold and partially wet track (sport auto 12/03)
7:40 --- 161.217 km/h -- Porsche 997 Turbo, 480 PS/ ??? kg, Michelin Cup Sport tyres (Motortrend)
7:41 --- 160.868 km/h -- Manthey Porsche GT3 M410, 413hp (AutoBild 07/04) ,
7:42* -- 160.519 km/h – Ford GT, 550 PS/ 1521 kg (*as indicated by Octane magazine, 11/05)
7:42 --- 160.519 km/h -- Mosler MT900S Photon, Joao Barbosa, (04) (according to dailysportscar.net)
7:42 --- 160.519 km/h -- Radical 1500 SR3, 230 PS/510 kg (02)
7:42.9 - 160.207 km/h -- Corvette Z06, 500 PS/1319 kg, Jan Magnusen, (Sporbilen, jun,26 05),
7:43 --- 160.173 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3 RS, factory test driver Walter Roehrl (MOTOR magazine)
7:43 --- 160.173 km/h -- TechArt Porsche GT Street, 620 PS/1453 kg, (sport auto 08/02)
7:43.5 - 160,000 km/h -- Lamborghini Murcielago (Autocar magazine 02)
7:44 --- 159.828 km/h -- Pagani Zonda C12 S, 555 PS/1388 kg (sport auto 07/02)
7:45 --- 159.484 km/h -- Gemballa Porsche GTR 600, 600hp (00)
7:45* -- 159.484 km/h -- McLaren F1, *estimated lap time from a video available at www.pistonheads.tv
7:46 --- 159.142 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT2, 462 PS/1450 kg (sport auto 06/01)
7:46 --- 159.142 km/h -- Jaguar XJ220, John Walton (EVO magzine 07/00),
7:46 --- 159.142 km/h -- SHK Porsche 993 GT2, 652 PS (sport auto 99)
7:47 --- 158.801 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3 RS, 381 PS (sport auto 03/04)
7:49 --- 158.124 km/h – BMW X5 Le Mans, 700 PS/~2000 kg, Hans-Joachim Stuck
7.49 --- 158.124 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3, 392 PS (AutoBild 2004),
7:49 --- 158.124 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3 Cup, 360 PS/1207 kg (sport auto 02/99)
7:49.72 157.885 km/h -- Honda RC30, Helmut Daehne (93) (moto bike)
7:50 --- 157.787 km/h -- BMW E46 M3 CSL (sport auto 08/03)
7:50 --- 157.787 km/h -- Lamborghini Murcielago, 462 PS/1450 kg (sport auto 06/02)
7:50 --- 157.787 km/h -- Westfield Super 7 with Hayabusa engine, >>>
7:52 --- 157.119 km/h – Ford GT, 550 PS/1599 kg (sport auto 02/06),
7:52 --- 157.119 km/h -- Gemballa Porsche 911 Le Mans (sport auto 95)
7:52 --- 157.119 km/h -- Lamborghini Gallardo E-gear, 493 PS/1496 kg (sport auto 12/03)
7:52 --- 157.119 km/h -- Mercedes Benz SLR McLaren (sport auto 06/04)
7:54 --- 156.456 km/h -- Mercedes CLK DTM AMG, 582 PS/1678kg, (sport auto 03/05), >>>
7:54 --- 156.456 km/h -- Porsche 996 GT3 (sport auto 06/03)
7:55 --- 156.126 km/h -- Caterham R500 Superlight, Robert Nearn (EVO magazine 07/00)
7:55 --- 156.126 km/h – Ferrari F430 F1, 490 PS/1493 kg (sport auto 01/06),
7:56 --- 155.798 km/h -- Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradale, 425 PS/1387 kg (sport auto 02/04)
7:56 --- 155.798 km/h -- Porsche 996 Turbo, 420 PS/1569 kg (sport auto 06/00)
7:56* - 155.798 km/h -- Chevrolet Corvette Z06 ,company chief engineer Dave Hill (*mfr.)
7:56.50 155.594 km/h -- Mercedes CLK DTM AMG, 582 PS/1678kg, Klaus Ludwig (AutoBild 02/06)
7:56.65 155.569 km/h – Lamborghini Gallardo SE, 520 PS/1560 kg, Tom Kristensen (AutoBild 02/06)
7:56.73* 155.569 km/h -- Honda NSX-R (*Best Motoring video "Carrera Invasion", lap not complete)
7:57 --- 155.472 km/h -- Lotec Porsche 993 Turbo, 600PS/1558 kg (sport auto 05/98)
7:58 --- 156.652 km/h -- Audi RS4 4.2 V8 FSI, 420 PS/ 1650 kg, Frank Stippler, (10/05)
7:59 --- 154.822 km/h -- Porsche 997 Carrera S, PASM setting “Performance”, (Walter Roehrl WHEELS 06/ 2004)
7:59* -- 154.822 km/h -- Chevrolet C6 Z51, company test driver Dave Hill (*mfr.)
7:59 --- 154.822 km/h -- Nissan Skyline R33 GT-R, Dirk Schoymans (Autocar magazine 97)

despite what those numbers say, in my mind the carrera gt holds the benchmark. every car above isnt really street legal, or the kind of thing you can drive regularly. a cgt can be driven anywhere in the world, anytime.

 

[toykilla]

this needs to go in the wiki

 

[toykilla]

Here we go Best motoring V22: Nismo Beast Unleashed

Bittorrent
[attachmentid=15044]

 

[boogiemyke]

I dl'd that vid recently and was a bit dissappointed. There's a point on the track that the driver has to slow down because of some sort of maintenance someone was doing. I actually did a little side-by-side video play of it versus the new STI (from same camera angle) to try and figure-out what he "might" have ran on the ring. By my guestimates, he may have been just under 8:00 for the lap time. I think it could've been driven even harder though. We don't know if Dirk was driving either, so that would be the "ultimate" comparison.

 

[vquick]

Dirk definitely wasn't driving the Z-Tune proto. It was some guy named Tanaka.

 

[dave]

Dirk definitely wasn't driving the Z-Tune proto. It was some guy named Tanaka.

I do know that Shin Inoue drove the Nismo 2005 Z Tune, but im not sure if it was on the track, I only saw the video of him driving it in the Street and Tunnel in Japan.

 

[smoothz]

regarding the z06 vs gtr argument,
the fastest recorded gtr nurburgring time is 7'59" for an R33. The R34 may be faster, but as far as anyone knows that hasnt yet been proven on the nurburgring. (ie no one can provide the date/driver/car/mods for a faster time)
the fastest z06 time is 7'42.9" this is well documented.

do those few seconds matter? that question is like asking if the quarter mile time matters. to some obviously it doesnt. after all, a vast majority of people who buy a given car cant take that car within 10% of its limits, enthusiasts included.

if you want to measure a car's ability to perform however, its a really good way to do it. and to many, this matters.
is the z06 the benchmark by which all other performance cars are measured? obviously not, but it is the best performance per dollar stock vehicle right now. anyone else making a sports car that tries to imply performance value will inevitably be compared against it.

having said that, im not a vette fan and dont think i'd ever buy one. but, i cant deny the performance/dollar. that car deserves a lot of respect. i dont see how any open minded person cant respect that car.

as for the upcoming gt-r, i only hope for a sub 8 minute time.

Oh, I respect the Vette. Very much so that I would like to own one someday (part of my stable). I definitely was not criticizing the Vette or any other major player in the sportscar world. I was just curious as to why.

The info being presented in this thread is great. I learn something new everyday. :cheers:

Dirk definitely wasn't driving the Z-Tune proto. It was some guy named Tanaka.

Maybe we should find.....



The Stig. :nervous:

 

[waitin407]

Alot of these lap times that are on the internet I don't see how they can be 100% credible. Most companies are doing their testing on closed track days when they rent out the ring for testing. The car's that are only a few seconds faster than the others are probably going to feel exactly the same to the average driver that purchases them from the showrooms. Since the times are from different drivers, in different conditions, and most likely with different timing equipment I wouldn't consider them scripture.

Even after all that I'd still like to see some new spy-shots of the GTR on the ring, it really got everyone excited when the first set came out.

 

[tekknikal]

you're defintely right on the different days, different times, different drivers issue- the 'ring time is by no means bible. but having said that, i think that it iis a good indicator. If someone can drive a car faster, then they would. many of those tests are from major publications and are recorded not rumored. By and large I think the list is generally representative of how the cars compare to each other in terms of stock performance on that track.

as far as the feeling part goes, two cars can do a track in the same exact time and feel completely different in the process. one car may be easier to push to the limits for example.

 

[vquick]

as far as the feeling part goes, two cars can do a track in the same exact time and feel completely different in the process. one car may be easier to push to the limits for example.

Exactly. If a development driver says that a car is a bit hairy to control, as in the case of the C6 Z06, that might be something of a bad sign. The GT-R will probably be easier to deal with in comparison, due to awd and a more conventional suspension setup. True, the GT-R may get active ride, but it's more conventional than a transverse leaf spring.

 

[waitin407]

Exactly. If a development driver says that a car is a bit hairy to control, as in the case of the C6 Z06, that might be something of a bad sign. The GT-R will probably be easier to deal with in comparison, due to awd and a more conventional suspension setup. True, the GT-R may get active ride, but it's more conventional than a transverse leaf spring.

This just reminds me of an episode of Top Gear when they went on for a good ten minutes about how the corvette still has leaf spring suspension.

I'm not saying the lap times mean nothing, just that when a car is coming in +-5 seconds to another car I don't think anyone should be dropping their jaws at how much better a performer it is.

 

[vquick]

This just reminds me of an episode of Top Gear when they went on for a good ten minutes about how the corvette still has leaf spring suspension.

The thing is, Jeremy and Co. didn't explain how the leaf spring suspension actually used a transverse mounted monospring made from composite. It's nothing like the leaf spring setups on the prams and midieval oxcarts Jeremy mentioned. The monospring is actually kind of advanced, since it saves so much weight. It still handles very well, too. Unfortunately, a downside of having only one spring for both sides of the car is that it doesn't react well enough to bumps.

evo drove a Z06 and a Roush-modified Mustang, and said that of the two, the Z06 was scarier on bumps, feeling like it was the car with the live-axle rather than the Mustang. In another test where one of the criteria was top speed at GM's Mibrook proving ground, the testers nearly lost control in the 170mph range because the minor bumps unsettled the Z06.

 

[smoothz]

The thing is, Jeremy and Co. didn't explain how the leaf spring suspension actually used a transverse mounted monospring made from composite. It's nothing like the leaf spring setups on the prams and midieval oxcarts Jeremy mentioned. The monospring is actually kind of advanced, since it saves so much weight. It still handles very well, too. Unfortunately, a downside of having only one spring for both sides of the car is that it doesn't react well enough to bumps.

evo drove a Z06 and a Roush-modified Mustang, and said that of the two, the Z06 was scarier on bumps, feeling like it was the car with the live-axle rather than the Mustang. In another test where one of the criteria was top speed at GM's Mibrook proving ground, the testers nearly lost control in the 170mph range because the minor bumps unsettled the Z06.

That's some scary ****. "Oh, hello. I need to turn away from the wall......NOW!"